Click below to watch the full conversation!
Jack Porcari
Hello everybody and welcome to the inaugural Loud Thoughts podcast. We’re doing our first episode today with my esteemed guest, Positive Nelson. The former United States Virgin Island Senator and former Department of Agriculture Commissioner is here today in a new role as the Cannabis Policy Advisor to Governor Albert Bryan Jr. In this capacity, he works as the cannabis czar, does training and is a liaison for the territory. Positive, he says, is not just a name, but an attitude towards life. Positive, thank you so much for being here with me today.
Positive Nelson
It’s my honor to be your guest, your first guest on your podcast. I’m always delighted to have a cannabis conversation. It is something that we all have to still be, as far as advocates, that we all have to continue to push on, because the work is not over. So thank you very much for the opportunity and on behalf of the Virgin Islands, we appreciate being able to tell our little piece of the story.
Jack Porcari
Of course, and so, I guess I’ll just jump right into it there. Tell me a little bit about your cannabis story Positive and how you got to this point today where you’re talking with the Governor, you’re talking with thought leaders and policy experts about cannabis in the Virgin Islands.
Positive Nelson
Well, of course, being of the Rastafarian culture, cannabis is a sacramental to the Rastafarian culture. It’s used in ceremonies, used for meditation and the Rastafarian community has been highly castigated and demonized for their popular use and advocacy for cannabis as is perhaps similar to the love child hippie movement. So there’s always been an interest. Having been in the Senate for some seven terms, individuals have asked me initially, but I did not want that to be the first thing I jumped on in the Senate. You know, Rasta, marijuana, feel like, oh, that’s the only thing I got in there for.
But after a few years in the Senate, it was obvious to me that it was important that as a Rastafarian, that I too use my seat in the Virgin Islands legislature to advocate at that level for the legalization of cannabis. So we launched a campaign, we did a referendum.
It was supported and they supported medicinal marijuana. That got passed. This governor, Albert Bryan Jr., signed the Medicinal Marijuana Patient Care Act in 2019 and then in January, 2023, the legislature repealed that Act and reenacted medicinal and adult use. So we’re here now in the Virgin Islands at the point where we have the Decriminalization, two ounces or less. We have industrial hemp passed and now we have medicinal and adult-use passed. The rules have just been finalized and we’ve started registration for practitioners, sacramental organizations and in the month or so there’s going to be registration for patients and sacramental users. We’re hoping by year’s end or by year’s end that we have licenses for dispensaries and cultivators.
Jack Porcari
Wow, lots of exciting movement there on the horizon and I got a chance to see a little bit of your legislative history. You’re no shy guy when it comes to cannabis and I want to go back to a moment, it was a press conference back, I think it was in 2020 and it was when you were in a big spread in Dope Magazine. You said it’s important that you take this seriously and that, you know, there’s no shame in this. As someone who’s really in the vanguard of policy, why is it important that there’s no shame in this?
Support our independent media company today
Expanding cannabis-infused storytelling through human narrative.
Positive Nelson
Well, as an advocate and as a Senator, pushing for legalization, I mean, if you could see some of those Senate hearings, the commentary my colleagues were making, it was discriminatory, unbecoming, unprofessional, you name it. For me, here I am, I’m a Rastafarian sitting in a political seat and the comments they’re making towards me, it was like stripping me of all my credentials. I have college degrees and all these things, but because I’m now advocating for cannabis, it’s like, you know, I’m a stupid dope head and that’s been what the story that they’ve said about cannabis for quite some time. So as advocates push for legalization and for free use, it’s important that we maintain our control, maintain our diplomacy, show them that we’re not just a set of hotheads trying to smoke weed, because that is what some of my colleagues were saying, like, ‘hey, he just has a personal interest.’ And I had to start being bold to say things like, if it was personal, I’d do like everybody else who’s smoking weed in the closet or undercover and just continue to smoke my weed in my quiet places and don’t give a damn about what’s happening around the world. But for me, the plant is just that, a plant and I don’t see the dangers. Of course, we’re all concerned about children and children access and children usage. So it’s not like we’re being irresponsible adults. I have four children, they’re adults now. You know, we are concerned about education and higher education. So it’s not like people who use cannabis, everybody that uses cannabis hangs out on the streets with no job. Many are hardworking professionals in very high technical fields of work. So as we normalize cannabis use, yeah, it’s very important that we kind of stay the course and push this thing through so that people don’t have to feel like culprits.
If after a hard day’s work, along with a glass of wine, I want to roll up some nice buds, sativa buds, and kick back on my couch watching a movie, and smoking a joint with my wine, so what? And that’s where we gotta be bold about it, so what? Okay, so what if I wanted to do that? So what if that’s not hurting anyone, and if you feel like it’s hurting me, then that’s my choice. So it leads to this whole thing about freedom of choice where everybody else has taken steps in other areas to get their freedom expressed and cannabis users should be able to do the same without being demonized. And so it’s very important for all of us because the truth is sometimes those in opposition would try to paint this image they always run to the children and they always run to fallouts of society as though that’s the norm of cannabis users. But the truth is they don’t know the face of cannabis users because we’ve had to be undercover because of a job, or because of the risk of being demonized, have been undercover for all this time. So we’re saying we’re tired of all of that. That’s why I think it’s very important that we add that clearly to the voice of advocacy.
Jack Porcari
Right, right and you know, you’re Rastafarian; this has been something that’s part of your culture. Did you ever think that you would be talking with everyone in this sort of way, regarding policy, regarding cannabis?
Positive Nelson
Of course not, of course not, of course not. You know, this is like a, it’s the feeling that comes over me even like, you know, the One Love movie is out now. So, you know, people like Bob Marley and Peter Tosh, Bunny Wailer, you know, these guys who’ve really taken a beating, you know, for their advocacy, the Rastafarian community. So, I’ve always supported the whole idea, but no, I never thought, first of all, I never imagined I would be a Virgin Island Senator, which is pretty much a US Senator. I never planned that. That was no ambition of mine. So being there and being able to be in the seat of government where I can actually not only advocate for the law, but actually be the author of, a sponsor of and push that law through the legislature to get it passed, to become law. I mean, I still can’t even explain the feeling. In previous interviews as I was asked the question, you don’t really think about it, you’re just doing the work. I’m just doing the work. You don’t really think about it to pat yourself on the back and all that kind of stuff, but there’s a lot of wounds, emotional and you know wounds and scars to that fight and so I feel good. I feel good having made these steps. But like I’ve said before, and I’ve said that at that forum where we met, none of us in our various capacities in the various territories, states, districts, or what have you, should be content with our own place or success on the advocacy role unless we get the federal government and the real head of this nation to yield and give up some of it’s restraints on cannabis. So the fight continues. Even though we’ve had success here, or the 34 states which have had success, the fight continues until we’re knocking on Washington’s door and the President of the United States acknowledges, first of all, to have it in a Class 1, you know, no good use at all. That is nonsense in this day and age. When doctors, science have already proven that there is medical use, the federal government themselves is doing testing with some, on PTSD, with their veterans: direct smoking pot, okay? Because of its efficacy dealing with trauma. So for them to not at least give in on that front, excuse my phrase, but it’s BS, bullsh*t. Excuse me, can I say that here?
Jack Porcari
Yeah, you can say that Positive. I mean, I encounter that in my own life. I got epilepsy and you know, I saw cannabis cut my dose of pharmaceuticals right in half. So to anyone in the audience listening, this is definitely something that is not just in the US, this is across the globe and this is a real fight, but the passage of §8680 there definitely is a big step forward Positive. So I definitely wanted to ask, talk to me a little bit about automatic expungement, kind of the implications for social equity and just your thoughts on that.
Positive Nelson
Okay, beautiful, and I’m glad you asked a good question and a good time because §8680 and §8679, which also provided funding for it and established the Auto Expungement Task Force, it provides for auto expungement for simple possessions and there’s other statutes as well that the Auto Expungement Task Force, which I’m a member of, are to consider if we want to include them for auto expungements.That is possession with intent to distribute, you know, and amounts even beyond two ounces. So those are also going to be considered. Actually the Act 8680-8679 asks for the Auto Expungement Task Force to put together recommendations which we will forward to the Office of Cannabis Regulations who will then send a report of these recommendations to the Governor, the legislature and the Supreme Court of the Virgin Islands. Then the Superior Court is to then auto-expunge all those who qualify for auto-expungement. And we feel that, of course, you know, this is really a big step in restorative justice for these individuals who can’t get housing, can’t get certain jobs, can’t get certain federal aides because of this being on the record. So, you know, we who are advocates of legalization and then the offshoot laws that have to change and accompany that are fully aware of the impact on families due to the supposedly war on drugs or war on specifically cannabis, AKA marijuana.
So the Auto Expungement Committee, we got all the recommendations today so in a short order, we should probably see the first slate of individuals actually being granted expungement and being relieved and released from this yoke, this choke hold that’s been on them ever since. Cause it’s not like they haven’t served their time and paid their penalty to society…Act 8680 does not prevent, did not anyway prevent individuals with records from participating in the industry anyhow, because we had already contemplated that because in our group who were organizing the bill, an individual who had actually served time and was already impacted, was at the table and continued to ensure that was in our thinking when we created the first bill.
Jack Porcari
Yeah, it’s always an evolution, right, with the cannabis policy. According to US News and World Report, they said something like 300 people have been arrested just for simple possession in the past 20 years in the Virgin Islands. I don’t know how up to date that is, or if there’s more, but it’s interesting to see how this rolls back and the process for doing so. Are you hopeful that these measures will eventually over time as, you know, updates and amendments, resolutions get passed that this will help to ameliorate the true harms of the War on Drugs?
Positive Nelson
Of course I am hopeful and that number you said: 300 in 20 years; it perhaps was a lot more than that but you know, understand that even law enforcement is who actually wanted and were part of the advocacy group in decriminalizing cannabis. Meaning, they call them the Monday morning cases. Even here, individuals, who in the justice department while I served as a Senator, came to me and said, Senator, we need to get rid of this Monday morning congestion that happens at the courts. So of course me being ignorant of what he’s talking about, I ask ‘what are you talking about attorney?’ Oh, every Monday morning, the courts are congested with these, we weekend arrests for simple possession, you know, and that takes time, that takes money, there’s a cost to that, that we should not have to deal with because why would we have to deal with people with these dime bag arrests? Okay, so even police departments, the judicial system, all of them were advocates of the change of law, at least towards decriminalization. I can’t say they were the same way with legalization fully, but they definitely wanted to stop having that, and it’s not only unique to the Virgin Islands, Monday morning cases…We look forward to this being really helpful for two individuals. I mean, I guess some folks think of it as nothing and even during our task force discussions, there was an individual who, when we were talking about including others, wasn’t supportive of including certain statutes because of whether distribution or [too] close to a school environment or what have you. I’m telling him, listen, expungement does not take away the penalty that they would have served for their crime. Expungement is only saying after you’ve served your penalty, okay, then can I at some point be reprieved of this record which prevents me from establishing a decent life or do you want me to be, because of my limitations with opportunities for employment, etc., do you want me to go do something that’s against the law? And that’s what we have to consider when we’re pushing these laws and that’s the idea of changing some of these laws so we stop criminalizing individuals for something we feel is not that dangerous.
Jack Porcari
Right and now we’re starting to see messaging directly from the OCR, Office of Cannabis Regulation, about how this is going to start playing out. So talk to me a little bit about all the fireside chats that have been going on. I know there’s one coming up about the sacramental use of cannabis on February 29th.
Positive Nelson
Ms. Carty, the current Director, created the fireside chat concept to have individuals with interests and she’s doing target groups…so that those within that area are free to just ask questions. There’s no formality in the discussion, it’s a real casual discussion. Questions they might have, you know, that they get a chance to speak directly with the Director. It’s a great opportunity. I think it’s a great concept where people don’t feel like they have to go up there in a shirt and tie and make a presentation, you know, even though you look quite dapper in yours but they can just sit back and talk to the Director. I’m there sometimes and then just talk to us about what’s going on, where we’re at, and how they can prepare themselves to participate.
We can’t act as consultants, you know, or any of the above, but we’re telling you about where the rollout is at, things that’s happening, and sometimes dates or, you know, months when things are going to be happening for you to be aware of. Of course, with cannabis there is interest, you know, the excitement of any new ground, you know, any new breaking through. Not just even if it’s breaking through here, there are people who’re watching, coming and looking with interest, you know, prospects. It’s the green gold rush, where people are coming, you know, to see what opportunity exists because one thing that all of us still have a problem with…we have a legal industry now being prevented from using the main financial institutions because of their fear of being negatively impacted for handling cannabis generated monies because of the federal insurance that they have, etc. That’s unfair because to me, the hypocrisy again of America at this point is their concern is they don’t want dirty money to get clean. But if you leave clean money sitting around and I’m supposed to do what? Keep burying it in the ground or keep hiding it in closets or in cars or wherever the heck I hide it, you know? Then you’re creating an opportunity: If you’re my buddy and I have thousands or millions of dollars stuck around in various places and you say, ‘Hey man Positive, lend me 50 and I’ll give you back 60 in two weeks.’ I’m likely to lend you and not even ask you, so as long as my money’s guaranteed back, I probably wouldn’t ask you. So now you’re creating what? You’re creating this whole financial movement going on outside of regulation. Is that what America wants? I don’t think so. So they need to get fast and do what they have to do to let the banks get comfortable. I think once they know that the money’s coming from at least a legitimate cannabis entity and there’s ways to check that, I don’t see why they can’t hold that money.
Jack Porcari
It’s definitely an interesting question because a lot of this stuff, it’s not cheap. I mean, the Executive Director Carty said each application probably takes around $25,000 just to review and then it can be up to $500,000 to get the licensure and the auditing and all those systems. I mean, what do you think in terms of fundraising, there are some interesting ways that OCR is looking to bridge that gap?
Jack Porcari
The central government has a hand in that also. The law set the expectation that after about two, three years of operation that the office will be able to fund itself, be self-sustaining. Currently, it provides for an allotment from the legislature annually to get it going. You know, those discussions are going to be ongoing because things take time to roll out. We’re not gonna have that big sum of money initially and the legislature might just have to appropriate monies for the operation of the OCR. But you know, once licenses start coming in and people pay these fees and we’re collecting taxes specifically in this area, then some of those revenues, whether they’re tax revenues and definitely the fees will go for the office to run itself.
Initially, we’re going to need funding. We have funding now. They’re actually looking to fill out positions in the Office now as well to support the Office. Some of the responsibilities are probably going to be through contracting, such as perhaps like some of the seed to sale tracking systems. We might have some consultants. There’s always going to be issues because there’s certain categories of licensing, especially as it relates to cultivation that are limited. The large cultivation is limited. The medium sized cultivation is limited. Microgrows are unlimited. So when there’s that bottleneck or that squeeze or that competition for those larger grows, that’s why we’re actually going to utilize a consultant initially to put this to the rubric process to ensure a fair selection of who gets these licenses, especially the ones that are limited. That’s where the challenges are going to come in. But yeah, money is always an issue, we’re a government agency.
Jack Porcari
Yeah, you guys will figure it out. There’s a lot of people looking to figure this problem out. I wanted to ask about how big this is going to get. I watched the testimony with the department of consumer affairs and they said around 17 dispensaries. Do you see it getting more than that? What does it look like on your end?
Positive Nelson
So the OCR has the discretion to recommend to the legislature to increase those numbers after a few years. So, you know, like any place, we’re three islands. This is the largest island: 84 square miles. So I would say we will just roll out the program, see what’s happening and see what the need is. The only concern I had, having been in the Senate, and I guess anyone would perhaps agree with me, that some of this authority should have been with the OCR as opposed to having to go back to the legislature because as anyone would know: getting a law changed is much harder than changing a policy. Just because of the politics behind who introduces certain laws and certain initiatives in the legislature. So I would have preferred not to have to go back to the legislature for everything, but currently that’s how the law reads. So that is the process.
Jack Porcari
Got it. I kind of wanted to touch a little bit here, because I’m a medical patient, on just the medical program that you guys have. The thing that was very interesting to me was that any condition that a practitioner would be able to prescribe opiates for, for pain, they could prescribe cannabis. I thought that was an interesting part of the law there.
Positive Nelson
Yeah, of course it is there, but it makes sense. It’s like, it’s obvious, because that is what we’re saying: that cannabis shouldn’t be an alternative medicine. Cannabis should be a first choice medicine, because it’s a botanical. So to use cannabis for treatment of pain, okay? Anxiety, comfort, trauma. It’s a much wiser move than using some of the conventional medicine, because the side effect is maybe you might eat a little more or you might sleep a little more, okay? Whereas a side effect that’s eating away at your liver or causing you to have to take another medicine. So yes, it was easy for us to include that in there, include as many ailments as possible and as many types of health professions as well as we were able to. And there’s some amendments pending now which is gonna include, I think, podiatrists were left out, and we want to include them as well, because the truth is, because of the interest to find out why cannabis appears to be so effective on treating pain in the human body, the medical profession in the Western world discovered the endocannabinoid system. An immune system within our immune system that they didn’t realize existed until they started to pay attention when cannabis is induced in the body and this thing comes out at that time. You know what I mean? It’s like think how weird that is. You had a regular look through the body, you wouldn’t see this immune system. But it’s activated when the components of cannabis are in the body. That’s undeniable. You follow me?
Jack Porcari
That’s loud and clear.
Positive Nelson
When they found out that, that thing was, you know, so effective, then it’s, of course, instead of opioids that you get addicted to, that leads to other kind of drugs, you know, instead of opioids that might eat out your liver and mash up your kidneys, you know, instead of opioids that might make you zombified. Here’s not only an alternative, but a first choice because the risk in using this as medicine and as recommended, they said they don’t wanna prescribe it because since the doctors are also regulated federally, they don’t wanna recommend its use, you know? Another—bullshit—you know what I’m saying? We need to stop playing around, you know, because the truth is, it’s more than anecdotal. Patients, like you say, you yourself are a patient. For us to tell you: oh man, Jack, you’re talking nonsense, when you know that your seizures have been decreased since you started using cannabis as a medicine, you know, when individuals know they’ve been helped and even go back to their doctors and the doctors see the difference, you know do the blood test and observe the difference as a fact.
All these agencies that benefit from individuals in the cannabis industry should step forward also, including the banks, because they stand to benefit. So to leave it up to just “cannabis folks,” marijuana advocates, all of those entities that stand to benefit. Right now, even right now, as we speak, there’s an aspect of cannabis that so many industries are capitalizing on and that has nothing to do with growing the plant. All these little packets, all these little machinery, all these little equipment, you follow me? It’s like a whoosh. So here you have a multi-billion, billion with a B, or trillion, let’s go to T. You have a trillion dollar industry, you know? It’s not just about the plant but all the things that are attached to that to help the businesses move. So, you know, I mean, we’ve seen cannabis stories in all of the Fortune 500, I mean, you name it, and all the big financial journals, we’ve seen them on the front page—so what are we still denying?
Jack Porcari
Yeah, right and, you know, it just goes back to something you brought up. I watched one of your livestreams on Facebook. You were talking about the art of living and harmonizing without losing yourself and mastering your thoughts in that way. As we’re at this moment, as we take inventory on the way that we live and how we harmonize with ourselves, what are you most excited for as we transition from legacy over to legal?
Positive Nelson
Well, first of all, I’m hoping that there’s legacy involved in that legal and we don’t still have to go in the back door corners to get some of the legacy stuff. You know, because the truth is we want legacy to be legal because they’re the ones who have the experience for decades. You follow me? Because think about this. If we don’t allow that, then we’re undercutting ourselves because we know this: for me, at the end of the day, quality is the bottom line. And if you have the quality, people will come to Timbuktu to get your stuff. You follow me? So if we don’t allow opportunities for legacy to be in the game, such as selling seedlings, selling clones, selling, you know, the breeds that we want, then we will be like, starting with fresh crops. Why would we do that? You know, why would we have a bunch of people with money who haven’t grown cannabis for years, who still are going to be trying to figure out the chemistry, all the do’s and don’ts. Is that where you would source your cannabis from? No, you source your cannabis from somebody who’s had the experience of growing it and can tell you the story on it. And even as we talk about that, what I would ideally like for me, I like the cottage industry concept when it comes to cannabis, boutique farms, where people have their personalized treatment and care, not just big whoosh, there’s something about that, when they get that personal touch from their grower. It’s a whole lot different. It’s like whether your child is raised at home with the mom or at daycare, you know, it’s gonna be a different child, you follow me? If the child can stay the first two, three years in the comfort of home with their mom, their family direct, as opposed to the first two, three years in a daycare with strangers, they don’t know who the hell they are, different people every week. Think about that, you see what I’m saying? So that’s the difference with legacy and yes, I would hope that we provide a way for legacy to be involved and that’s the conversation we’re also having now. As the cannabis advisor, I’m tasked with, and it’s strange because you’re asking me to go talk to people who we’re not supposed to know about. And they got to be able to trust us to come above board. Okay, and that’s the challenge. Do they trust the government enough? Do they trust the law enough? Do they trust these policies enough to change over from what they’ve been doing for 40, 50 years? To come risk and that’s why even as we talk about fees and taxes, we can’t have those too high. If I’m just saying if I’m a legacy grower and I’ve been doing this for 40, 50 years and now you’re telling me, ‘hey man, come on man, come on, register, be part of the legal industry.’ In my mind, I gotta be saying to myself, man, but I’ve done this for 40, 50 years and I’m doing all right and coming in the industry is just going to talk about more fees, being known, risk of, you know, my homeboys who didn’t know I was doing it, coming by now trying to rob me. I mean all of these things come up now. Now, and on top of that, you’re telling me I can’t put my money in the damn bank? So, I’m hoping the government realizes that if they truly want to reduce the illegal market, they’re gonna have to make the process to legalization not only simple, but safe. That some level of reassurance for individuals to transition because, you know, legacy grows, part of their safety is their secrecy.
You were talking earlier about one of the concepts about thought and the power of thought. Yeah, I, what I like, one thing about, and I’ve heard this from many users of cannabis, is cannabis allows you to think about what you’re thinking. That’s why for me, I feel without having any science background, I feel the reason it even is so effective on this post-traumatic syndrome is that it allows your conscious mind to go walking into your subconscious mind while you’re up. Not while you’re sleeping, you know, but while you’re up, your child, your inner child starts exploring your inner thoughts and that way you can see some of those caged monsters that we’ve yet to release. I feel, you know, eventually they’ll find some scientific terminologies for it and as they start to apply cannabis use to allowing individuals a quality of life again. And that’s what we’ve heard, that’s what we’ve seen, that it has restored a quality of life for many individuals.
I remember one story when we went on an exploratory trip to Colorado and Washington state that there was this individual who could not work, was unable to work because the seizures were so bad that they couldn’t work anywhere because they were so frequent. Not only were they intense, but they were frequent. And when cannabis came aboard and they started using cannabis, they were able to subdue these seizures and be able to lock down a job. We learned about cannabis refugees, there was an individual who’s a young male. His mother moved him from Georgia when they were saying, pretty much told her son is going to die and she’d been hearing about this cannabis thing. It was only after they told her that that she packed up and hauled tail and went to a cannabis state where cannabis medicines could be applied and save her son. He was on death’s bed and cannabis restored him. But her story that she was highlighting was the fact that however, they had to be refugees in another state pretty much because their law prohibited that and to save her son and to keep her son alive, you know, the family had to kind of split sort of, you know, father stay in Georgia with other children and, you know, keep them going there. And mother goes to Colorado, you know. We should not have to go through that to save our children. Come on, you know, come on.
It’s just time to release that, you know, and if it is, if it is, the pharmaceutical industry is concerned with competition. And they may not be that because I’m quite sure that, you know, they have experience in dispensing medicines. They have experience in, in packaging, you know, and dispensing medicine. Instead of taking a hands off or some secret approach, they should be joining the advocacy and helping the industry to be safe. You see, and then they’ll get their eat out of it too, instead of just looking at it as competition. Greed don’t benefit anyone in the end. You know?
Jack Porcari
Right.
Positive Nelson
If we have 10 roast chicken on the table and you wanna be greedy and you wanna eat all at one time because you don’t want anybody else to get any, you’re going to be sick, you’re gonna be sick. Even if you could eat all 10 of them, you’re going to be so gorged and bloated, you know? So, what I like about the cannabis community is that sharing, that sharing, that exchanging and I don’t want it to be lost in commercialization and competition.
Jack Porcari
And I think that’s a really big point you just made there because I think, at least from my experience, that has really been integral to the culture of this plant, has been the ability for strangers to come together, for people to share a plant, for people to share a moment. for people to really make an impact like you saw on that person’s life in Colorado and things of that nature. How do we do that? How do we make sure this isn’t just in the rear view mirror after all this stuff passes and we commercialize the plant?
Jack Porcari
And I think that’s a really big point you just made there because I think, at least from my experience, that has really been integral to the culture of this plant, has been the ability for strangers to come together, for people to share a plant, for people to share a moment. for people to really make an impact like you saw on that person’s life in Colorado and things of that nature. How do we do that? How do we make sure this isn’t just in the rear view mirror after all this stuff passes and we commercialize the plant?
Positive Nelson
Right, because I myself am concerned with commercialization because all the greedy people start using chemicals and whatever to have bigger fatter buds and don’t give a damn about the impact. So I think what we do is this, we know that right now in the underground market, there’s sort of like a, they have a self check built into it. If somebody’s stuff is bad and the word gets out, they’re pretty much shut down because people ain’t gonna go to bad stuff, you know?
Here in this industry, now being legal, that’s where the regulation comes in. That’s where the Department of Health has to come in. That’s where the lab checks gotta come in, especially for things that have to go for medicinal use. The lab checks come in. But I’m really hoping and praying that, and that’s where legacy growers come in too. There’s a certain pride in legacy growers. You know, I want to have good, clean cannabis.
And that’s why we have to let them be the ones who can really be the ones who are benefiting now. Because they’ve, over the years, under the gun of the law enforcement, have still ensured that there’s good, clean, high-quality cannabis available to those who seek it. And it’s very important to me that we hold on to the integrity of the industry and sort of have some kind of way to shout out, call out any entity, whether it’s a grow facility, a dispensing facility, a processing facility that is using unscrupulous ways or things that are unhealthy ways.
Jack Porcari
Sure.
Positive Nelson
Look at all these years, I mean, cannabis is getting legal now, but cannabis has been popularly used forever. Thousands of years. Cannabis gets blamed for this mixture. People put Fanta, okay? People put blunts. People put, you know, we call it laced cannabis with other things, okay? And then cannabis takes the blame. ‘Oh, he was smoking some weed,’ okay? He was smoking some weed with what else in it, you know? And it’s unfortunate because, most of those incidents when something happened, it was some other thing along with the cannabis. and I’m not telling you that there’s not been incidents where people got too high and freaked out a little bit or what have you. I’m not telling you that didn’t occur, especially now with concentrates. Concentrates are something we have to look up for as well because the concentrates can be so strong that it might cause some out of body experience that you’re not accustomed to, you know, not go crazy, but it can be quite scary for individuals who are not aware of what’s going to happen. So, you know, I think making sure that we are as much as possible, monitoring the industry, using some of these monies that the governments are collecting and the agencies who have oversight over the industry in the various states, districts, territories, that we’re hiring the personnel to, as much as possible, to ensure this is good, clean stuff and also that the illegal stuff is not fighting its way into the mainstream legalization.
Okay, the comfort, and we saw this ourselves as we visited numerous dispensaries in these states, we’d stand up in a dispensary just to see the type of the clientele that’s coming in and you can see it’s a great company, you know? It’s very different if you have to go around some street corner and say, ‘give me a puff,’ and when you reach home, you realize it’s cuckoo weed. You can’t do anything with it. It smells like shit, it smokes like shit. You can’t do anything with it. And you are trying to get you rid of your anxiety. Now when you go to a dispensary and they say, ‘Oh Mister Nelson what would you like this evening?’ you know, ‘Did you want to watch a movie or are you just trying to get to sleep early and crash out,’ and they can recommend. ‘Try this Tangie, and this OG and this indica right here.’ That’s another level of stuff right there. That makes you feel like somebody. The nice dispensary layout, you know, somebody budtending to you. I mean all of a sudden I don’t seem like some creepy dude trying to cop some ‘drugs.’
Jack Porcari
Right, and I know we mentioned it a little earlier and I think it’s important to talk about for those young folks that might be watching this later: What message do you have for younger people in specific that are seeing all of these changes happening, regulations loosening, penalties being erased, you know, what message do you have for them?
Positive Nelson
Thank you. Great question. The message is this: same thing like sex, alcohol and everything. Wait your time. It’s no rush. The road is long. You know, the science has said that the growing mind is not is not hardened until the age 25. So you want to watch and I’ve seen the impact of my schoolmates back in the day, those who used to skip school and skip classes and go smoke weed and you know, I’ve seen where it changed their lives. So yes I would tell young people, as curious as you may be and don’t get me wrong we were curious too and we took a puff here a puff there just as young people. But you don’t want to act like you’re a regular consumer of cannabis until you are at a certain age because you want to be able to remain focused, just save your mileage, take your time. You’re gonna get there. Same thing with alcohol, same thing with sex. It’s the same message. Take your time, save your mileage. There’s no rush to it, y’all, trust me. There’ll be enough time. You know, right now just get high on life so that when you get to the point that you want to use your cannabis, you have a job or you’re self-employed, so you wouldn’t have to worry about, you know, somebody testing you, you have your own place, so you don’t have to worry about your old-fashioned parents who are still saying no and you’re in a State that can allow your 6 or 12 plants. Take your time young people. There’s no rush to it. Yes I’m an advocate for legalization but I’m more so an advocate for you making the best of your life and if you over consumed now, that’s like burning your candles at two ends.
Jack Porcari
Thank you, Positive. Yeah, that’s some good insight for our young folks out there. Speaking about highlighting the plant and just chopping it up, I saw that Executive Director Carty was talking about highlighting Virgin Islands strains. I want to hear more.
Positive Nelson
Well, unbeknownst to many, Virgin Islands cannabis has probably won cannabis cups before and I know of at least two instances. Steve Cubby was down here, who was part of the initial initiative in California when they first pushed for legalization back in the early 1990s. So he came down here and I saw him get on the phone and call one of his buddies in whatever state it was and said, ‘hey, what I’m observing down here as it relates to cannabis in the Virgin Islands, cannabis on St. Croix, where he was, is that it forces us to rethink our theory, our hypothesis.’ This is what he’s telling the guy on the phone. So I’m listening and he says: ‘Our theory is that inside climate control cannabis is superior to outside grown cannabis, outdoor cannabis.’ He said, ‘I want us to rethink that because what I’m seeing in this subtropical area here on St. Croix, this stinky, sticky buds that damn near you can throw at the wall and it’d stick. He said the density of the terpene oils, not because of the sun, the region, it’s sun but it’s not that just dry, arid sun, like in the desert. What they’re seeing here forces them to rethink that. So we expect to have some phenomenal things happening here in the Virgin Islands. Ideally, I would like for some entity to establish a real cannabis research center here in the territory. Think about it, being on the easternmost point of America, where the sun hits America first, and we’re sending some specialized, especially when things get more relaxed and we can have, whether it’s a compact with various states or the federal government actually allows for transport beyond borders, that we can send sun-grown cannabis from America’s paradise to the rest of America and the world. Imagine that. You know, imagine that. Yes. Cannabis is like a Caribbean commodity, really.
Jack Porcari
Yeah that would be just something else.
Positive Nelson
Warm weather stuff, yeah. Yes, yes, yes.
Jack Porcari
What cultivar is really popular down there? Do you know any that are really notorious?
Positive Nelson
I can’t, there’s nothing that I will mention because anything that’s happening would be illegal. So that’s a set-up question, Jack! Good try, but what I can say is this: being in the position that I’m in, having been a Senator who has advocated for legalization, there are many individuals who have exposed themselves to me, okay? By wanting to show me what they’re doing, they want to give me samples. Sometimes they shake my hands and after the handshake, I have something in my hands. It’s scary sometimes. Because they want me to see: ‘hey, this is happening.’ Especially when they’ve heard the Senators, the legislators say on the Senate floor that all Virgin Islanders wouldn’t be able to meet the grade. You know, there are individuals who have stepped forward. Last year, 420, as illegal as it is, we pretty much had a, we called it a Taster’s Choice event right here at my place at Serenity’s Nest. There were about eight samples that made their way to tables here, to be determined which one had the best hit and the best flavor. So that was interesting and it’s exciting to see, you know, because I’ve seen cannabis around from early days, and I’ve seen the quality really, really improved, especially as legalization conversation came.
As a matter of fact, I don’t mind saying this. So several years ago, an individual who I knew but I did not know him in that capacity, asked me to meet with him and when he met with me, he started to tell me these things about how he represents a group of growers here in the territory and they realized now that this initiative is going to pass. They wanted to know what they could do to prepare to participate. So, you know, I was honored to be having that conversation because that meant they trust me enough. And he knew me, He knew me. You know, he knew me as a teacher and all of these things. So I’m sitting there, of course, trying to get my head together. Imagine like, you know, he’s talking to me about cannabis. But I’ve seen them improve, like I told all them, you know, the quality has to be able to be consistent, you know? You have to have good stuff. They have to find ways to. protect that flavor and just, you know, have cycles and all of these things. And I think these guys have done it. Not I think: they have done it. I’ve even had the opportunity to be taken in blindfolds to certain grow sites for individuals who want to show me that they have professional setups. Now mind you, I’ve been to Colorado, Washington, Oregon in actually reviewing some very elaborate grow systems, lab systems, etc. And I’ve seen some individuals here with some real nice setups. Maybe not as large, but very nice setups and capitalizing on our consistent warm weather as well. So, you know, sunny weather rather. So, that’s why I expect that notion that we might have special strains coming out of here is highly probable.
Jack Porcari
Yes, yes, highly probable. Well, hey, Positive, I just have one last question for you. I want to know what you’re most excited for going into 2024. If you have anything you want to talk about, new projects, I’m all ears.
Positive Nelson
Well, so 2024, you know, so every year I come up with a theme, especially now that I’m doing the grow room and the theme this year is: I am opening my door in 2024. And I—I am. So it’s what each individual is saying and what I’m encouraging is for each individual to grow beyond where they are. So I’m looking for 2024 in cannabis, in the development of the Virgin Islands, hopefully the development of humanity in itself.
We are able to, first of all, understand that we are more than our physical self. There’s the whole one love concept is that we all are, we all are siblings of creation. I mean, not just humanity, but everything in creation has an equal portion of divinity and if we can learn to just tolerate and harmonize with each other, you know, we will make the world what we seek for. We want peace in the world but we don’t have peace on the inside. So for me, along with cannabis legalization, cannabis freedom of use, I want people to get into that peace child, you know. If you look at the historical Rastafarian community, if you look at the historical peace child, hippie flower child community, that concept of love, peace, harmony, where people look at them, they’re crazy. They’re not crazy. But we are caught up on that treadmill. Let’s call it a societal matrix. By 25, we’re supposed to do this. By 50, we’re supposed to do this. By 60, we’re supposed to have this. We have all these timelines and we’re on this wire. We’re tied to our technology now. We were on vacation, but we are tied to the phone. We’re on the beach, but we’re on the phone. We’re in the ocean, but the phone rings and we run out of the ocean to answer the phone. We’re wired.
So what I’m hoping for in 2024 going forward is that we really are willing to open our door to peace, to contentment and to understand that that’s going to take some discipline, that’s going to take some subduing of our desires and our wants because desires and wants create our worries. So open the door to do more, open the door to be more, you know and the universe will open for you. They say, don’t walk like the world revolves around you, walk like the universe revolves around you because it actually does.
In any situation you encounter, yes, yes, yes. Remember that God is real, God is love. Keep peace in your heart. And yes, say it and mean it. Stick your finger in your chest. I am opening my door in 2024. Even if you’re unsure, go through that door. Thought and fear demands nothing. Go through that door. Willpower is all you need. I’m going to stop there because I’m getting charged up, Jack!
Jack Porcari
Positive, I want to say thank you so much for being here on the inaugural episode of the Loud Thoughts Podcast and just sharing your Loud Thoughts with us. It really, really means a lot and this was a great conversation.
Positive Nelson
Yeah, but thank you for doing it. I encourage you to just stay on it. Some days you’re gonna not feel like it, but just stay on it because a voice out to the world is a voice out and sometimes we don’t know it, but there’s somebody or some people who need to hear exactly what we have to say. We all have a little bit to contribute to each other. Remember: we share that divinity. So you have something and I have something that we have got to tell the world.